Release Notes 2017-6-28 tlopo-rc-v1.2.4

Bottom line here is that in either scenario (ram wipe OR rollback), there will always be a party that is unhappy. We cannot please everyone. We thought it best to only remove the "problem area" (read: cannon rams specifically) rather than interrupt ALL player progress over a ~2 day span. We really do apologize that it has to be this way - unfortunately a case of where a few individuals ruin something for everyone else.

Let it be known however that this is still Beta. Things will go wrong. Testers will have to do things over due to problems. This is just one of those scenarios. The community truly does have all the time in the world to gain these items back, considering we're still in Beta.
 
The community truly does have all the time in the world to gain these items back
Not trying to argue against taking the rams away, I understand it completely, it's no big deal to me. However, this statement is not true, most of us have real life responsibilities to tend to. I personally work from 8am-5pm every weekday and spent my only free time in these past 2 days doing cannon defense, so yes it can be frustrating to lose things when you are using up your only free time to get those so you can move on and enjoy it. Now personally, I don't care too much because in the 10 hours I spent on cannon defense, I never actually got the one ram I wanted so I didn't really lose anything other than rams I'll never use anyways; just understand that others did.

Once again, not arguing against the decision, what's done is done, and there's a valid reason behind it. I just have a particular problem with this statement and it is not true at all, a lot of us don't have all the time in the world.
 
You'd think that the game exists at all would be compensation enough. It's not as if the decision was made out of hatred.

Does it suck? Sure. Does it negatively impact people who earned their rams without exploits? No doubt. I don't think anybody expected this to be a popular decision, but it wasn't made without consideration either. Ultimately it was decided that removing an entire class of item was preferable to doing a 2+ day rollback. People would have surely been (vocally) unhappy either way, but the exploit was heavily abused (more than some seem to think) and the item class was non-functional at this point anyways, so the call was made.

It's been said a billion times over, and here it is once more: It's a beta, and things can and will go awry. Personally, I find it disappointing that everyone wastes no time complaining about issues that negatively impact their experience... but when a bug works out in their favor, few people (if anybody) reported it. It is extremely unfortunate that it impacted people who did not exploit the bug, but because there is no record of when or where items were earned, that's just the way it is.
While the decision for the devs to remove all cannon rams from the game is unfortunate, I think it's better than either of the alternatives. The only other options they would have are:
  1. Do a complete rollback of 2+ days
  2. Leave several extremely powerful, rare, and illegally obtained items in game
To be honest I think what they chose to do is better than either of these options. Remeber everyone, this is beta. This isn't the full game. Things will happen, stuff will go wrong and weird measures might be needed to contest that.
 
I just have a particular problem with this statement and it is not true at all, a lot of us don't have all the time in the world.

I don't think he meant it literally. What he means is that the game is not going anywhere. Unless someone - God forbid - is being limited in their time on this Earth or is for some reason losing their access to the Internet, the players of TLOPO will have time to gain back what they lost, even if it takes more time than originally invested.
 
Not trying to argue against taking the rams away, I understand it completely, it's no big deal to me. However, this statement is not true, most of us have real life responsibilities to tend to. I personally work from 8am-5pm every weekday and spent my only free time in these past 2 days doing cannon defense, so yes it can be frustrating to lose things when you are using up your only free time to get those so you can move on and enjoy it. Now personally, I don't care too much because in the 10 hours I spent on cannon defense, I never actually got the one ram I wanted so I didn't really lose anything other than rams I'll never use anyways; just understand that others did.

Once again, not arguing against the decision, what's done is done, and there's a valid reason behind it. I just have a particular problem with this statement and it is not true at all, a lot of us don't have all the time in the world.
I certainly did not mean to dismiss anyone's real-life responsibilities (or yours, for that matter). I was hoping to illustrate that point in a more general sense. We're still early on in the game's development and ultimately its lifetime. There is still plenty of opportunity to gain back lost items, much to the dismay (unfortunately) of those who "wrongfully" lost items in this scenario specifically.
 
I got a ram legitimately from fishing but I understand why they did what they did. From what I read people were going crazy getting rams from the exploit. That is not right and they were justified in taking the rams back. I don't see how they could tell who got them legit or through the exploit so it is understandable they would take them all. When cannon defense gets fixed we can all play it and get more rams. May this be a lesson for those who knew they were exploiting that it doesn't pay.
 
Why is it that when we have a legitimate complaint about something that is actually unfair we are told to be thankful that the game is actually being remade? Don't you think we already are? Of course we are. But that doesn't mean there won't be outcry when something very bad happens.
Frankly because that's when a reminder is most needed. Of course everyone is happy and appreciative when things are going well, but people become fickle really quickly when they have to face some of the harder to swallow consequences of playing a free beta game. I certainly don't mean to uniformly dismiss criticisms, but it'd be nice if people let some of the love they claim to have shine through when things aren't so great too. I don't mean everyone has to like the decision, but it'd be nice if they showed their support and appreciation for the team by at least respecting us and doing their best to see where we're coming from. We do understand that hearing you're going to lose an item through no fault of your own is a message nobody wants to receive... but the staff wouldn't still be here today after all the obstacles and other problems they've faced if they didn't care about the community or the game.

Since I know we won't be re-reimbursed for the ones we had legitimately, you could at least re-assure us by saying something like "We'll try and implement systems to better log who loots what item and when"
That's just not in the cards right now. If it's difficult to stomach the idea of server rollbacks, losing inventory items, or worse then I'd personally recommend shying away from beta (though we do what we can to ensure those are kept to a minimum).
 
Well its not the end of the world its just frustrating when you get something you can't ever get again. And besides. When complaining about something or critiquing something you always have to be polite. Otherwise its just insulting, and its not beneficial.
 
You'd think that the game exists at all would be compensation enough. It's not as if the decision was made out of hatred.

Does it suck? Sure. Does it negatively impact people who earned their rams without exploits? No doubt. I don't think anybody expected this to be a popular decision, but it wasn't made without consideration either. Ultimately it was decided that removing an entire class of item was preferable to doing a 2+ day rollback. People would have surely been (vocally) unhappy either way, but the exploit was heavily abused (more than some seem to think) and the item class was non-functional at this point anyways, so the call was made.

It's been said a billion times over, and here it is once more: It's a beta, and things can and will go awry. Personally, I find it disappointing that everyone wastes no time complaining about issues that negatively impact their experience... but when a bug works out in their favor, few people (if anybody) reported it. It is extremely unfortunate that it impacted people who did not exploit the bug, but because there is no record of when or where items were earned, that's just the way it is.

I believe the most (amazingly) overlooked statement in this response is. "You'd think that the game exists at all would be compensation enough."
I mean really... I'm truly not trying to dig under anyone's skin but please think about that a moment... There are people who wake up every day and bust their rears so I can log into a FREE game and enjoy adventuring in this world. I can't stress that enough. Yes it's beta... But even if it wasn't... This is their call to make and I understand their logic. It truly pains me to log in and see people jumping down the throats of those who work hard and delight in recreating something for the public to enjoy.................... And................ It must pain them infinitely more... I implore people to consider before posting... Is what I'm about to write constructive, encouraging or appreciative ... If it isn't... It probably would be best not to post it. I really love this community... Lets not act like a dysfunctional family. ;)
 
Please allow me to put this in a little bit of a different perspective. I'm truly not trying to upset or hurt anyone. Imagine you and I are neighbors. You wake up on Monday and mow my yard... On Tuesday you come over and wash my car... every week now! Out of the goodness of your heart. On Wednesday you wash all of my windows... On Thursday you cook me a meal and deliver it... and on Friday you come over and weed eat my yard and trim up the bushes.................... Now imagine that I come out and say the windows are streaked, you didn't detail the car this week, you didn't pick up my cigarette butts and my dog poop when you mowed my yard and the lines are a little crooked from the mower. Dinner was okay but it was kind of cold and you missed around the trees when you trimmed....... You would be beside yourself. You gave and gave and now you feel unappreciated... even attacked for what you did for me. I can't express my appreciation enough for what these people are doing for us... I know they are doing the absolute best they can every day and that ultimately it's in the best interests of the project moving forward.
 
I guess I'm one of the lucky ones, I've never really done CD (the one time I did it was until wave 2 when I realised the ships took no damage and gave up) so wasn't aware of the exploit and I'd not had any rams drop in loot from anywhere else, so I lost nothing. But much as I realise what a tough decision removing rams from the game was (for the devs and the people that gained them legitimately) I am very grateful that they chose that rather than a rollback.

I've suffered several rollbacks (2 of them major ones) in another game that I've played for 6-7? years. The first one was due to an exploit that was used by some players. Despite the fact that they could trace every individual that used the exploit and lifetime banned every account involved (by IP address so households with multiple people playing had some that lost their accounts that weren't even involved) and despite the fact that the items gained from the exploit were bound to the character that received them so couldn't be given or sold to others, the company still decided to do a 1 week rollback.
The whole situation was truly awful. For those left behind that were NOT involved with using the exploit....well we all lost huge amounts of character progress, Elite(Legendary) boss drops....some even lost major game changing items that they'd gained by buying things in game with real money. No one was compensated, no apologies were given, no real explanations were given by the company.

Personally speaking I've seen the horrors of rollbacks and I'm very happy the Devs didn't choose that route. To those that gained their rams legitimately- please don't misunderstand, particularly those that had the rarer types, I feel very bad that some innocent people lost items too.....I just recognise that it could have been much worse
 
it'd be nice if people let some of the love they claim to have shine through when things aren't so great too.

Make a dev appreciation thread then. At this point it's pretty ridiculous that moderater response to reasonable community opinion (in a thread you must have known would draw some ire, mind you) is basically: "Too bad; so sad! Say you love me!" A bit more understanding, and a whole lot less patronizing would be nice. Remember: this was in response to someone who simply asked for a statement regarding better logging of loot acquisition in the future. Pretty reasonable from someone who will lose legitimately gained items.
 
Please allow me to put this in a little bit of a different perspective. I'm truly not trying to upset or hurt anyone. Imagine you and I are neighbors. You wake up on Monday and mow my yard... On Tuesday you come over and wash my car... every week now! Out of the goodness of your heart. On Wednesday you wash all of my windows... On Thursday you cook me a meal and deliver it... and on Friday you come over and weed eat my yard and trim up the bushes.................... Now imagine that I come out and say the windows are streaked, you didn't detail the car this week, you didn't pick up my cigarette butts and my dog poop when you mowed my yard and the lines are a little crooked from the mower. Dinner was okay but it was kind of cold and you missed around the trees when you trimmed....... You would be beside yourself. You gave and gave and now you feel unappreciated... even attacked for what you did for me. I can't express my appreciation enough for what these people are doing for us... I know they are doing the absolute best they can every day and that ultimately it's in the best interests of the project moving forward.
Unless Ned Flanders is your neighbor, this would never happen lol...
 
I remember Potco in its early days losing our characters...so many trolled the forums(and if you remember, they locked threads ...often!), that they informed us that we didn't "own" any thing....all virtual property was theirs.

And thats the truth of all online games. Most put it in a contract or eula. Things happen. In a game we aren't paying a thing for at all, no subscription, etc....and....its in testing phases....we are lucky to have capped characters, upgraded ships, our 'stuff' at all.
 
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Make a dev appreciation thread then. At this point it's pretty ridiculous that moderater response to reasonable community opinion (in a thread you must have known would draw some ire, mind you) is basically: "Too bad; so sad! Say you love me!"
I'm only speaking for myself, but that's not really what I'm saying. Some anger and frustration is to be expected, yes. Some people, though, seem to take it above and beyond and insist that this was done carelessly or act like it was done with a vengeance. It strikes a nerve because I've seen how deep the entitlement can run with some people time and time again. What I'm asking is for those people to respect that the team made this decision because they thought it was the best of the options they had, even if they disagree personally. I believe through their perseverance over the past couple of years that the team has demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt that they do care for the game and community. So while people are free to share their thoughts and complaints, it's disheartening to hear people take it as far as to say otherwise. I'm making a personal appeal for people to keep something in mind when voicing their criticisms in general. That's all.

Remember: this was in response to someone who simply asked for a statement regarding better logging of loot acquisition in the future. Pretty reasonable from someone who will lose legitimately gained items.
What was asked for was a commitment that we'd take steps to ensure something like this wouldn't happen again for the rest of beta and beyond. I said that's not really a promise we can make right now. I didn't say it was completely ruled out in the long-term.
 
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