Loot Do Ammo drops in containers reduce chance of rare weapon drops?

LeeFoster2

LeeFoster2

Honorable Pirate
For example, a loot skull chest can drop up to 5 items, including clothing, cards, etc. However, when you have used ammo of a certain type like venom shot, it will drop in chests and pouches. My question is, does the slot used by ammo drops take up a slot it could have used to roll a rare or famed weapon?
 
I've actually been wondering this. I've seen loot containers hold nothing but cannonballs, which makes me wonder if I had not spent any cannonballs - would that container have had something good in it?
 
Until somebody can clear this up, I'm gonna play it safe and no longer use special ammo when loot farming.
 
I would say that it does effect it. Just from a loot run perspective, I've gotten 1 famed when I haven't had full ammo and 30+ and a legendary whilst having full ammo. Could just be random though but the number difference kinda makes me want to lean one way.
 
I tested it, and here are the results:

With every single consumable emptied: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 22 loot skull chests. In those, almost every single one of them contained 2 or 3 of the slots filled with my lost consumables. Also, any time a consumable was completely refilled, I emptied it. However, I did obtain the following items:
  • 3 Famed Items (Swamp Throwing Knives, Masterwork Cutlass, Divine Sabre)
  • 6 Rare Items (Meaningless crap)
  • 5 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).

With every single consumable full: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 19 loot skull chests. In those, I had an additional 2 or 3 slots that were filling with loot rather than consumables. I obtained the following items:
  • 1 Legendary Item (Lost Sword of El Patron)
  • 4 Famed Items (Brigadier's Broadsword, Seven Seas, Golden Idol, and War Scattergun)
  • 8 Rare Items (Meaningless Crap + Carrion Doll)
  • 16 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).


That is my analysis, so I concur that HAVING FULL CONSUMABLES INCREASES LOOT CHANCES.
 
Ataelos said:
I tested it, and here are the results:

With every single consumable emptied: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 22 loot skull chests. In those, almost every single one of them contained 2 or 3 of the slots filled with my lost consumables. Also, any time a consumable was completely refilled, I emptied it. However, I did obtain the following items:
  • 3 Famed Items (Swamp Throwing Knives, Masterwork Cutlass, Divine Sabre)
  • 6 Rare Items (Meaningless crap)
  • 5 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).

With every single consumable full: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 19 loot skull chests. In those, I had an additional 2 or 3 slots that were filling with loot rather than consumables. I obtained the following items:
  • 1 Legendary Item (Lost Sword of El Patron)
  • 4 Famed Items (Brigadier's Broadsword, Seven Seas, Golden Idol, and War Scattergun)
  • 8 Rare Items (Meaningless Crap + Carrion Doll)
  • 16 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).


That is my analysis, so I concur that HAVING FULL CONSUMABLES INCREASES LOOT CHANCES.
Click to expand...
Excellent data gathering there. It's not enough for me to agree it's conclusive, but it certainly supports the theory, and I am inclined to agree with you so far. I applaud your willingness to the cause!
 
Appreciate you doing it, i was gonna do it myself this weekend.


Glad I posted my question for all to see.
 
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Ataelos said:
I tested it, and here are the results:

With every single consumable emptied: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 22 loot skull chests. In those, almost every single one of them contained 2 or 3 of the slots filled with my lost consumables. Also, any time a consumable was completely refilled, I emptied it. However, I did obtain the following items:
  • 3 Famed Items (Swamp Throwing Knives, Masterwork Cutlass, Divine Sabre)
  • 6 Rare Items (Meaningless crap)
  • 5 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).

With every single consumable full: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 19 loot skull chests. In those, I had an additional 2 or 3 slots that were filling with loot rather than consumables. I obtained the following items:
  • 1 Legendary Item (Lost Sword of El Patron)
  • 4 Famed Items (Brigadier's Broadsword, Seven Seas, Golden Idol, and War Scattergun)
  • 8 Rare Items (Meaningless Crap + Carrion Doll)
  • 16 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).


That is my analysis, so I concur that HAVING FULL CONSUMABLES INCREASES LOOT CHANCES.
Click to expand...
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the consumable list you filled up to proceed. Sword would be the way to go as it doesn't use any ammo, correct? Maybe use dagger with no throwing. But I did notice that all my skulls had lots of ammo coming up in rewards.

Another thought, if a reward from skulls or any plundered item game script is reading your profile to see if ammo is used so that it can reward that back. does it stand to reason that the same script or another would also run down your inventory, see how many rares you already have and use some sort of formula whether to gift you another fame or legendary? I think rares and below are true random depending on your levels, but fame and legendary may have some sort of other program working their averages out.
Just a thought.
 
squintz said:
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the consumable list you filled up to proceed. Sword would be the way to go as it doesn't use any ammo, correct? Maybe use dagger with no throwing. But I did notice that all my skulls had lots of ammo coming up in rewards.

Another thought, if a reward from skulls or any plundered item game script is reading your profile to see if ammo is used so that it can reward that back. does it stand to reason that the same script or another would also run down your inventory, see how many rares you already have and use some sort of formula whether to gift you another fame or legendary? I think rares and below are true random depending on your levels, but fame and legendary may have some sort of other program working their averages out.
Just a thought.
Click to expand...



A consumable item would be bullets that deplete, cannonballs that deplete, tonics, and so on.
And for the second script you are thinking of, no it doesn't exist.
There is a large variety of scripts making sure that you receive certain item types based on level, weapon use, and entity defeated; but there is not a script that changes how your luck works effectively based on your inventory because the chests actually generate the loot when you open them, not when they drop.
 
Ataelos said:
A consumable item would be bullets that deplete, cannonballs that deplete, tonics, and so on.
And for the second script you are thinking of, no it doesn't exist.
There is a large variety of scripts making sure that you receive certain item types based on level, weapon use, and entity defeated; but there is not a script that changes how your luck works effectively based on your inventory because the chests actually generate the loot when you open them, not when they drop.
Click to expand...
Interesting theory that the loot is generated when opened. Based on that logic, if loot is factored by say, consumables, and I whack 4 ghosts at once, who each drop 2 pouches, 1 loot chest and one skull chest respectively, then I should be able to alter what the skull chest generates depending on the order I open things. I would then open the lesser hoping to fill consums and junk first, then the skull would have better loot?

Personally, I think the loot is set when each ghost dies and the item appears, and not when you click on them. Another interesting I noted while grinding last night, was if I didn't get over to the last 2 items they would disappear totally. And while I was standing there not doing anything and the matching ghost has not spawned.
 
Like all experiments, It's best that others do it too. I think It's even more important that others post their findings here, since Ataelos's data could have just been luck.
 
squintz said:
Personally, I think the loot is set when each ghost dies and the item appears
Click to expand...
You could test this theory by having full ammo, killing something 'till it drops a loot pouch or whatever, then spending some ammo. If ammo is found in the pouch, the loot is generated when you open it.

Personally, I think you're all overthinking it. Ammo or not is all that should matter. Most games loot tables don't exactly care about stuff like "how many famed you have" or "how many loot boxes you've opened in the last hour" or "what order you open them", especially older games (though TLOPO did rewrite their loot system).
 
Ataelos said:
I tested it, and here are the results:

With every single consumable emptied: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 22 loot skull chests. In those, almost every single one of them contained 2 or 3 of the slots filled with my lost consumables. Also, any time a consumable was completely refilled, I emptied it. However, I did obtain the following items:
  • 3 Famed Items (Swamp Throwing Knives, Masterwork Cutlass, Divine Sabre)
  • 6 Rare Items (Meaningless crap)
  • 5 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).

With every single consumable full: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 19 loot skull chests. In those, I had an additional 2 or 3 slots that were filling with loot rather than consumables. I obtained the following items:
  • 1 Legendary Item (Lost Sword of El Patron)
  • 4 Famed Items (Brigadier's Broadsword, Seven Seas, Golden Idol, and War Scattergun)
  • 8 Rare Items (Meaningless Crap + Carrion Doll)
  • 16 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).


That is my analysis, so I concur that HAVING FULL CONSUMABLES INCREASES LOOT CHANCES.
Click to expand...
I definitely think you're on to something. Here's what I did last night in el patron mines. Same end room with 4 33-43 lvl ghosts.
I went in fully stocked and used my dagger (leveling it up-might as well) and killed roughly 45 single kills. Altering every one from side to side.
In first 3 kills I did get a skull with just 10 gold and a bandana. At kill 11 I threw 1 sidewinder (SW) and on very next kill -12th I got a sw in loot chest. On kill 13 threw 1 sw and got a sw with crap loot back on next kill 14. Kills 15 - 19, just gold and clothes and low weapons. To this point I got maybe 2 low rares. Kill 20 I threw 1 sw and loot was nill. Kill 21 I got 1 sw in loot. Kill 22 got skull with 10 gold and 1 trinket. Kill 23 I threw 2 sw's and low loot. Kills 24 to 27 normal nothing loot but on 27 I received 2 sw in loot. to this point I had not seen any consumables taking a spot in any loot. From kills 27 to 45, no thrown or used consumables including potions, (they don't hurt me enough to drink anything, but I used pork maybe twice) and no more rares shown up and no fames at all. And except for the 4 or 5 sw in loot, I never saw any consumables in loot period, like I did the other nights when I used grenades, knife throws and such.

Although I didn't get anything good, I think it was too short of a test with only two skull chest to prove or disprove Ataelos's theory, I'm going to agree with him that there is something to full consumables and better loot. At some point I will just use sword on ghosts in the group and do a longer grind.
 
Ataelos said:
I tested it, and here are the results:

With every single consumable emptied: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 22 loot skull chests. In those, almost every single one of them contained 2 or 3 of the slots filled with my lost consumables. Also, any time a consumable was completely refilled, I emptied it. However, I did obtain the following items:
  • 3 Famed Items (Swamp Throwing Knives, Masterwork Cutlass, Divine Sabre)
  • 6 Rare Items (Meaningless crap)
  • 5 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).

With every single consumable full: I looted in El Patron's Mine at the South Idol with a sword for six hours on Andaba. After doing so, I had exactly 19 loot skull chests. In those, I had an additional 2 or 3 slots that were filling with loot rather than consumables. I obtained the following items:
  • 1 Legendary Item (Lost Sword of El Patron)
  • 4 Famed Items (Brigadier's Broadsword, Seven Seas, Golden Idol, and War Scattergun)
  • 8 Rare Items (Meaningless Crap + Carrion Doll)
  • 16 Brights (including yellow, orange, and other terrible ones).


That is my analysis, so I concur that HAVING FULL CONSUMABLES INCREASES LOOT CHANCES.
Click to expand...
Is the south idol room in the same map of el patron mine with the 4 ghosts that I have been attacking? How does one get to south idol? Oh wait, just looked on the wiki... that's where I've been..do'h!
 
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It seems logical to me that having full ammo gives an improved chance at better drops.

If a Skull chest has (random figures) 40 potential items that it can drop and 15 of those items are various types of ammo....it stands to reason that if you have full ammo... therefor removing those from the 'potential drop' list, then the remaining 25 items all have a higher chance to drop :)
 
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