Fps spikes?

Aussie

Sea Legs
i notice my frames go from 60 to 40 which is odd given the game takes very little resources
is this just me or is it for everyone else?

i have a gtx1070
and a i7 7700k overclocked to 4.5
 

Cyclone

Notorious Pirate
i notice my frames go from 60 to 40 which is odd given the game takes very little resources
is this just me or is it for everyone else?

i have a gtx1070
and a i7 7700k overclocked to 4.5
The game has old graphics so there´s really not much to expect but what you can do is restart you pc/mac whatever your playing on. And restart that like every 3 hours approximately. Gotta give a shout out to @Charles Warmonk for saying it on one of his streams
 

Crimson_Rose

Honorable Pirate
It doesn't fix it, I have a laptop that exceeds the games requirements 12 times over and for some reason i still get horrible fps. Youll have the people that defend this game to the moon and back. But its just the game, its horribly laggy for some reason and the fps tend to drop randomly. Just have to deal with it until they can improve it.
 

ThunderStorms

Pirate Lord
i notice my frames go from 60 to 40 which is odd given the game takes very little resources
is this just me or is it for everyone else?

i have a gtx1070
and a i7 7700k overclocked to 4.5
Changing the clocking won't help , mine varies from 35 - 62 depending on where I'm at , use to run between 54 - 62 in potco .
 

Misha

Forum Mod
The game's optimization is poorly strung out for a number of reasons. One currently that can be named (and will be patched up in due time) is the fact that the game still runs on a 32 bit installer/packaging software; Once 32 bit OS has been phased out and the game has been upgraded to entirely running on 64 bit OS, there will be a ton of optimizations that will hopefully smooth over a number of framerate issues with the game.
 

squintz

Pirate Lord
It doesn't fix it, I have a laptop that exceeds the games requirements 12 times over and for some reason i still get horrible fps. Youll have the people that defend this game to the moon and back. But its just the game, its horribly laggy for some reason and the fps tend to drop randomly. Just have to deal with it until they can improve it.
The multiplayer part has always been sub par. Perhaps the 64bit may help. Perhaps not.
Part of me feels it is because Panda on the whole was not designed to be a packet handling internet based graphic engine, but a designer and production engine for art and rendering. Not like unreal, which was designed ground up to be optimized for internet packet handling and bit flow stuff and more real time rendering tasks.
Like trying to shoehorn graphic rendering and power point into microsoft word.
 
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Shamus The Brute

Site Founder
The multiplayer part has always been sub par. Perhaps the 64bit may help. Perhaps not.
Part of me feels it is because Panda on the whole was not designed to be a packet handling internet based graphic engine, but a designer and production engine for art and rendering. Not like unreal, which was designed ground up to be optimized for internet packet handling and bit flow stuff and more real time rendering tasks.
Like trying to shoehorn graphic rendering and power point into microsoft word.
To add to this, one can assume Disney knew wholly about the problem given the (POTCO) notifications plastered via loading screen (the tips/suggestions 'notifications') to which suggested that everyone log on/log off beyond a couple of hours of playing time.

It was quite the nuisance to deal with a lot of the "timeout" error kicks once you got busy playing the game and simply forgot.
 

squintz

Pirate Lord
To add to this, one can assume Disney knew wholly about the problem given the (POTCO) notifications plastered via loading screen (the tips/suggestions 'notifications') to which suggested that everyone log on/log off beyond a couple of hours of playing time.

It was quite the nuisance to deal with a lot of the "timeout" error kicks once you got busy playing the game and simply forgot.
Disney is all about disney and disney ownership. I would submit that panda at the time was chosen also for it's security and content protection capabilities. Not exactly for it's game play. It also sounds like disney never quite conquered the memory problems as well.
The business side of content control and distribution always has a say in games.

All nostalgia aside, if other remakes use a different engine that runs much better than tlopo, then tlopo will go the way of the extinct past attempts. All the hard work, nostalgia and creative juices put into tlopo will be for naught if people can't even play the game without being reminded of fps and dc's every few minutes. It's human game nature. They will go elsewhere. In the end it's nothing personal, it's just what they do.
 
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Bart Gunshot

Site Founder
The multiplayer part has always been sub par. Perhaps the 64bit may help. Perhaps not.
Part of me feels it is because Panda on the whole was not designed to be a packet handling internet based graphic engine, but a designer and production engine for art and rendering. Not like unreal, which was designed ground up to be optimized for internet packet handling and bit flow stuff and more real time rendering tasks.
Like trying to shoehorn graphic rendering and power point into microsoft word.
FPS is almost never related to networking in fact its best to say its just not related. Panda3D doesn't even handle the networking for the game. Disney's OTP (Open Theme Park) server handles that. It was built with MMOs in mind, to handle many people connected all at once, and it is what Astron (TLOPO's networking solution) was built to mimic, utilizing publicly available documents and confrences Disney or Disney employees themselves publicly released.

Panda3D's default render pipeline to my knowledge doesn't utilize newer GPUs (Video/graphics cards) very well. Likely just a remnant from Disney trying to get their games to work on nearly every system, and failure to update and innovate for newer hardware. Panda3D is actually having a newer render pipeline being developed for it, however it probably won't help much for TLOPO because (although I cannot say for certain) it probably utilizes different methods that would be too much work to implement into TLOPO as it would require a lot of core code rewriting.

That being said, TLOPO has said they have been working on updating the game to 64bit, which will allow the game to use more than ~4gb of ram. This shouldn't really increase FPS, but improve stability. They have also mentioned they are rewriting portions of Panda3D to better utilize the system resources available. This theoretically should increase FPS. When you'll see this, who knows. But that is what must be changed for improved FPS, it is no fault to networking as you claim.

You can make a slow, low FPS game with any game engine by the way, yes, even Unreal. That brings another point, how POTCO utilizes the Panda3D engine. I can't say much for this as I haven't actually looked much into it myself. However I'm sure part of the fault is POTCO's own object loading, interests, etc.
 

squintz

Pirate Lord
I wouldn't disagree with any of that, except this --> "FPS is almost never related to networking in fact its best to say its just not related."
Frames per second is part and parcel to internet gaming. Graphics image rendering is processing whatever data is in the pipe at any one time. Everything hands off to everything else in processing and slow internet creates lag, which creates basically poor frame rates.
To try and separate these multiplayer processes like they are totally different and independent from each other is too simplistic and almost insulting to people. Regular none tech people playing tlopo with their fps meter on watch the fps drop 40 frames as the game lags when approaching a boss with even a minimum of 5 players and they just got done playing wow at 120 fps on broadband and we're supposed to believe it's graphics only? Then tlopo astron is struggling doing a job of mimicking.

Actually, fps is archaic. It's a throwback to analog times and screen rendering on crt's in lines of data. You used to refresh the screen so many times a second and the brain perceives it as moving images. Faster refresh, smoother action on screen. We're digital, everything is done full screen or page now. There really isn't a 'refreshing' of LCD, LED or OLED monitors. It's just easier to go with the older acronyms than trying to educate people to newer tech.

I've watched my fps drop in tlopo when people log in and out trying to meet. Last year I was on a low bandwidth connection and fps was 5.
Then I came on another broadband and the fps was a constant 20-30 which isn't great either. I've always have low fps on my window machine with tlopo. But I can go back and forth with the same machine on those two connections and get consistent differences between them. Sorry, low bandwidth, low fps, higher bandwidth, higher fps. For whatever reason. All these processes have to play together efficiently for a quality end result. And that's all that matters to the end user.

How can we beta test if we are dc'd all the time?
 

Bart Gunshot

Site Founder
I wouldn't disagree with any of that, except this --> "FPS is almost never related to networking in fact its best to say its just not related."
Frames per second is part and parcel to internet gaming. Graphics image rendering is processing whatever data is in the pipe at any one time. Everything hands off to everything else in processing and slow internet creates lag, which creates basically poor frame rates.
To try and separate these multiplayer processes like they are totally different and independent from each other is too simplistic and almost insulting to people. Regular none tech people playing tlopo with their fps meter on watch the fps drop 40 frames as the game lags when approaching a boss with even a minimum of 5 players and they just got done playing wow at 120 fps on broadband and we're supposed to believe it's graphics only? Then tlopo astron is struggling doing a job of mimicking.

Actually, fps is archaic. It's a throwback to analog times and screen rendering on crt's in lines of data. You used to refresh the screen so many times a second and the brain perceives it as moving images. Faster refresh, smoother action on screen. We're digital, everything is done full screen or page now. There really isn't a 'refreshing' of LCD, LED or OLED monitors. It's just easier to go with the older acronyms than trying to educate people to newer tech.

I've watched my fps drop in tlopo when people log in and out trying to meet. Last year I was on a low bandwidth connection and fps was 5.
Then I came on another broadband and the fps was a constant 20-30 which isn't great either. I've always have low fps on my window machine with tlopo. But I can go back and forth with the same machine on those two connections and get consistent differences between them. Sorry, low bandwidth, low fps, higher bandwidth, higher fps. For whatever reason. All these processes have to play together efficiently for a quality end result. And that's all that matters to the end user.

How can we beta test if we are dc'd all the time?
I'm sorry but this is just incorrect, confused with real facts at best. The graphics rendering does not await a response from the server every frame, every 2 frames, or even every n frames. It renders what it has at the given moment. If there is a lot of objects or effects on screen it will take longer to render that frame, therefore cutting into the frames you get in a single second (FPS - Frames Per Second). FPS drops whenever there are more players around simply because there are just more objects to render in that scene - complex objects at that. The server simply pushes data to the client on updating positions of things, telling it what to load in where, etc. and the game doesn't wait for a response with this data before it does anything. You might notice this when enemies suddenly freeze and stop responding suddenly, the FPS will not drop at all. Because the rendering engine doesn't wait for this information to be sent.

FPS isn't archaic, you may be thinking more of refresh rates (which aren't exactly archaic either). FPS is simply a measure of how many frames (images) your computer is producing in a second, Frames Per Second. Refresh rates are a measure of how many times your monitor can refresh it's image in a second. This is most commonly measured in hertz (hz). Most monitors are 60hz meaning they update their image roughly 60per second. But this can go up to 200+. The more time your monitor updates its buffer in a second means the more frames your eyes are seeing. You could be getting 100FPS on a 60hz monitor. But you'll only be seeing about 60 of those frames per second. (or seeing part of last frame and part of next frame - screen tearing)

Loading objects in once your player character passes into a region in which they must be loaded can create stuttering or freezing, as this delays the rendering of the next frame. You might notice this when walking around on any island in TLOPO. There are certain "boundaries" where you load in a bunch of new objects and the game may stutter. Loading in objects such as players is pretty resource intensive as there are a lot of things that go into a player. This isn't related to networking though. The server is simply sending data to the client and receiving data from the client. The client does not wait for this information to render frames (as I've already mentioned). However if it gets data that a new player character just appeared in your scene, then the client must load in that data. But the bottleneck is NOT the server, because the client doesn't wait for this data. If it gets it THEN it does something.

If you stop getting a response from the server then the client starts a countdown of sorts. However it doesn't "pause" waiting for a response. You are still able to maintain your FPS and do activities even though they may not actually have any affect. If this countdown reaches a certain time then the client disconnects you. If the game were to actually await responses from the server for every n frames, no one would be able to play simply because of the unpredictability involved. Packet loss, ping, etc. It would be unbearably choppy.
 
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