At the "Edge" of My Wits

Captain Del

Captain Del

Pirate
As many of you know I like to keep my guild mates under a well-managed code of honor to ensure that all of them turn out to be the best pirates they can be. This entails a lot of things, though one of the more specific and loosely-defined parts of these guidelines would be not using certain glitches.

With the recent rise of the age of Ship Customization and the constant need for doing battle with the ever-dangerous bounty hunters that drop those precious ship materials, many pirates who have become desperate for them have resorted to a new glitch referred to as the "End of the World" glitch. The captain of a ship uses the barrier known as the Edge of the World to slide against an invisible wall, which, when sailing against, allows for that ship to go unharmed as the the enemy ships are unable to fire at them. It's a true phenomenon as to how it works, and moreover how it has managed to catch on with so many pirates.

I deliberated for a long time as to whether this glitch should be "frowned upon" or not in my guild because while it is not necessarily considered a "cheat," it is cheating in the sense it allows for a pirate to skip the constant loom of damage against his or her ship and thus become "invincible." Only recently did I decide that this practice would not be used in my guild, though today I was shocked to find out how the subject matter of this "glitch" was actually more disputed than I imagined.

My guild mates and I were out on material run this afternoon, captained by our very own Benjamin Cannonwallace. We were doing pretty good, but seeing as how the hunters were beginning to challenge our crew, we opened up public and invited a few of our friends to join us.

Things went smoothly for the first few hunters; our crew was strong enough to take down the hunters in a matter of a few seconds, and we weren't taking much damage, though we did have a few pirates who worked the repair spots quite well. Eventually the war ships showed up, and right as a Tally-Ho approached us from the side I had to make a quick ammo run.

I teleported away and got back to the ship in a little less than a minute, but when I got back the atmosphere on the ship had entirely changed - the ship had taken substantial damage, and the entire crew (the majority of which were high leveled pirates who had entered through the Public setting) was yelling at my guild mates on a vary of issues. "REPAIR FASTER" "WHAT ARE YOU DOING?!" "Why aren't we doing the End of the World glitch!?"

The latter of the three was the most prominent issue, which only grew after I asserted that my guild didn't believe in using that glitch (which we had asserted earlier in the run.) The majority of the argument was whether the glitch was "cheeting" or not - while I and my guildies argued that it was because it makes your ship unable to take damage, the other pirates argued that the glitch was a "tactic" and was simply a smarter thing to do than sailing head on. They also asserted that in order to have a proper fight with bounty hunters you needed a good captain, which they implied my guild mate was not.

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It seemed to me that the main thing that drove those pirates was the fact that it made it easier for them to acquire materials, and that in order for you to have an actual fight with bounty hunters you needed a lot more time and skill than would normally be needed on a regular sailing run. Although I won't argue that it does indeed take a lot of patience and skill, it doesn't take away from the fact being invincible against damage is cheating, and that the only thing cheating does is make the game unfair between players.

I allowed for the glitch to be used for only a moment so that we could allow ourselves to prepare while the massive fight was going on board the ship, but even because of that my guild mates and I felt guilty - so much so we inevitably ported the ship minutes afterwards.

It angers me that pirates now adays, (as so lovely put by Captain Sharktooth,) have become so depended on glitches for everything they do that they become irrational when they are faced by a group of pirates who chooses not to use them. The fact that these pirates went so far as to challenge the authority of both myself and the captain of the ship, as well as insult our intelligence simply because we are against using a "tactic" like that, only shows how some pirates have forgotten to be kind towards other pirates.

So, I propose to you all today with a question: Do you believe that the "End of the World" glitch is cheating?
 
I believe it is cheating. Its not fair to those who play by the rules and who do not use these glitches. It is in-game, but.. it is a glitch that is not meant to be there. I'm all for harmless glitches such as being able to stand on a roof.. I feel that these glitches are cheating the game and other pirates though.

I think it was a very wise choice to port - glad you have a conscience. :)
 
I choose not to use any glitches, cheats or exploits. I classify the edge of the world "tactic" as an exploit.

The wide spread use of this exploit is because it is truly not easy to fight warships. The hunters with a semi decent crew can be taken with out much problem. Yet a hunter and a warship is a daunting task.

A test pirate was the creator and founder of the edge of the world. It was done to speed up the process to get our ships maxed so we could get the new content hashed out for live. The sad thing is some testers took this to live.

I heckle those that use it, and cry that I use it. Because it truly requires no skill. I was on a ship yesterday that was on the edge. It was manned by a crew of no higher a level then 14. They were all furiously shooting a Battle-Royale. It took a long time to sink it.

I do agree that the crop of new pirates are more dependent on the use of cheats, exploits, and glitches. This wide spread lack of will to face a challenge is sad.

I agree Dell that the edge of the world is an exploit. It uses to an advantage something that the Game Developers had not intended. I will not do it. I encourage all pirates to not do it, but short of Lord Mouse making an adjustment to eliminate it. I fear it is here to stay.

All those of us that do care can do is frown upon it. Stand together and frown upon it. Then pray Lord Mouse helps us out!
 
I don't believe it's cheating. It doesn't harm anyone, doesn't create lag/problems for the game, etc..

I can easily sink a full cargo's worth of Battle Royales and Tallies with a crew, though it takes forever. Ship Customization made it to where if you don't have a rank 4 (6 now, with those annoying Copperheads) you are generally unable to sink anything in SVS, and are usually frowned upon and thought to be a 'noob' if you do not have a high-rank ship. EoW makes runs a lot quicker, especially if you just want to do a short run in a war sloop or something for the finishing amount of materials on your ship.
Also, if you're on a pirate that's a lower level (like my pirate Kat for example) and find it harder to get materials because of weaker broadsides, lower level sailing, something of the sort, EoW helps a ton.
It all depends on your beliefs on this 'glitch'. (I'd rather not call it a glitch, but to each their own) If you think it is cheating, then, you do not have to use it. If it you do not think it is cheating and like to use it, then use it. Everyone has different opinions, and people should not act like those pirates on your ship and downgrading other people because of their opinions, and others saying that those who do use it are not 'true players of the game', are 'cowardly', or 'scared of a challenge' is wrong too. I use it, and I am a skilled sailor of 4 years.
 
I don't consider this a glitch... Because they didn't intend for your ship to turn around as soon as you get to the edge you just keep sailing forward blocked by a invisible wall. It's just how it was made, a glitch is something that's not suppose to be there and the wall is suppose to be there and so are the reactions of the ships that run into that wall. So it's not a glitch and i find it very useful. (also your away from everything so less lag)
 
Even though the barrier that was created at the End of the World was not utilized to turn ships around, I highly doubt that it was intended to be used as a means of not allowing ships to attack you.

The matter is not so much of it being a glitch as it is an exploit, and the larger subject matter is if it is cheating regardless of what it is. While it is not a lack of our corruption of coding, it allows for pirates to become invincible, gather materials, and essentially progress forward in the game without facing a challenge. If I found a way to gain reputation without having to do anything besides sit on Tortuga and swing my sword at empty air, it would be considered cheating because I'm going farther in the game, and thusly gaining an advantage over other pirates, without having to face the same challenges as everybody else. What makes this any different?

My guild follows a simple rule of thumb when it comes to dealing and deciding upon whether glitches/exploits should be used: If it affects the game, the guild, or gives you an advantage over others, it is frowned upon. This "tactic" allows for you to become a stronger sailor/cannoneer without facing the challenge that was intended by the developers to block you from that level of power; and, no matter how much strategy and might it may take, my guild and thousands of other pirates have managed to progress through the levels of Ship Customization without needing to rely on a time-saving, challenge-killing exploit.
 
It's NOT cheating. You sail sideways, what is the big deal? Maybe the Warships are glitching us? Maybe Mickey put it in the game on purpose to help us out? Many people don't have time like others who sail 10 hours a day. This "not-glitch" helps save time on repairs, helps sinks ships faster, which gets you materials faster, allowing those of us who don't much "game time" a chance to upgrade our ships.
Thank you Mickey I love you!
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The end of the world definetly wasn't meant for ships to 'glide', but I don't think it really harms anyone. I don't really like it though because it takes SOOOO long to do a materials run that way.
 
I really do not see the problem with this glitch, for the same reasons previously stated: It is not causing harm to other players, and it gives an advantage towards lower levels who would have a much harder time sinking hunters and war ships without it. I do understand that it could be thought of as "cheating" but I actually don't see it as that big of a deal, and I think it would be alright for players to get help from that.
 
Perhaps you are missing the point that gathering materials is meant to take hours upon hours, so that pirates will have to work and challenge themselves in order to get that fitting, almighty reward of conquering the seas. Why would the developers intentionally allow an exploit to occur that defeated this purpose?

The End of the World glitch was developed by Testers so they could quickly gather materials to test all of the bits and pieces of Ship Customization, and then get it on to Live. They were not concerned with dominating Bounty Hunters, being the best at Privateering, or having the shiniest ship - they were using it as a way to quickly test the game.

Now, however, players on Live have adopted this practice so that they can reach the very points that the Testers were ignoring when gathering materials. On Live the game is much more subjective, and because of that players now have the ability to have better ships than pirates who actually face the game as it was intended and, as I stated before, have an advantage.

I find it funny that pirates beg for a challenge, and then when one arises, they try and find the best way to completely work their way around it. How could this not be cheating if it removes a purposeful part of the game and allows pirates to go straight in and reap the rewards?
 
Captain Del said:
I find it funny that pirates beg for a challenge, and then when one arises, they try and find the best way to completely work their way around it. How could this not be cheating if it removes a purposeful part of the game and allows pirates to go straight in and reap the rewards?
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People have been facing the 'challenge' of Bountyhunters for months before EoW came out. It's not like EoW gets rid of the option not to do it; you can still fight them any way you want. And nobody tried to work their way around the bountyhunters. Like you said, they made EoW to get materials faster to get Customization to Live.
I wouldn't even consider the rank 5 and 6 hulls rewards anyways, because the upgrades are so useless. About material runs having to take hours; some people just don't have the time. Work, school, holidays, schedules, chores, other siblings, all these things limit peoples' playing times. A lot would rather do a 30 minute run and get half materials on EoW than waste their playing time and only get half.
 
I agree with you, Del. I think that it pretty much is cheating. All of the enemy ships are there to challenge and test the strength, teamwork, and skill of a captain and his/her crew. This glitch defeats the purpose of the challenge... well... because it simply is not a challenge. I personally like the thrill of wondering whether I might sink or not- just like real pirates loved the thrill of facing challenges that occured on the sea. I think that it is not nice for them to come on your guild's ship and complain. If they wanted to use the glitch because they believe in using it then they could sail their very own ship! I also very much agree with what you say about people begging for a challenge and then when one is given one, they try their best to figure out a way in which to make the challenge not a challenge anymore. It takes the fun out of everything and involves hardly any skill or strength to pull off.
 
Constance O'hara said:
People have been facing the 'challenge' of Bountyhunters for months before EoW came out. It's not like EoW gets rid of the option not to do it; you can still fight them any way you want. And nobody tried to work their way around the bountyhunters. Like you said, they made EoW to get materials faster to get Customization to Live.
I wouldn't even consider the rank 5 and 6 hulls rewards anyways, because the upgrades are so useless. About material runs having to take hours; some people just don't have the time. Work, school, holidays, schedules, chores, other siblings, all these things limit peoples' playing times. A lot would rather do a 30 minute run and get half materials on EoW than waste their playing time and only get half.
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I'm not sure how you interpreted my post; by "Get Customization faster to Live," I meant Testers customizing their ships for the sake of testing so hey could find all of the bugs that needed to be cleaned out. Testers have used plenty of exploits like this in the past only for the sake of testing, so I cannot imagine why somebody on Live would use it other than avoiding having to face Hunters.

And trust me, I barely have time to play as it is now. I usually can get on for about 1 to 2 hours a night (by which point I am dead tired) on the weekdays, but that doesn't stop me and my mates from hitting the seas and taking out some hunters. With this kind of schedule I haven't even been able to get all of my ships to Rank 2, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying the game. It was designed to take hours and hours on end, so why would it not be considered cheating if I were to go against the nature of it?
 
Captain Del said:
I'm not sure how you interpreted my post; by "Get Customization faster to Live," I meant Testers customizing their ships for the sake of testing so hey could find all of the bugs that needed to be cleaned out. Testers have used plenty of exploits like this in the past only for the sake of testing, so I cannot imagine why somebody on Live would use it other than avoiding having to face Hunters.

And trust me, I barely have time to play as it is now. I usually can get on for about 1 to 2 hours a night (by which point I am dead tired) on the weekdays, but that doesn't stop me and my mates from hitting the seas and taking out some hunters. With this kind of schedule I haven't even been able to get all of my ships to Rank 2, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying the game. It was designed to take hours and hours on end, so why would it not be considered cheating if I were to go against the nature of it?
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Does it hurt anyone's gameplay, mood, etc..? No. Does it disrupt the game? No. Does it remove the fun in the game? Not really. Bountyhunters are not hard for the ones who can sail. I can easily take one out solo in 3 or 4 broadsides. It's not avoiding facing hunters. It's mainly to save time on runs, because you don't have to do a lot of running, turning, attacking, running, turning, attacking so on and so forth. Some people don't have the skill to fight Hunters, also. Not many people on this game can sail as well as hunters require. I've been on tons of ships who can't even sink a simple Cutter Shark without losing half their HP. Like I said; it's just as wrong to pretty much say people who do EoW are scared of challenges and hunters as it is to tell someone they're a 'noob' to not do it.
 
Constance O'hara said:
Does it hurt anyone's gameplay, mood, etc..? No. Does it disrupt the game? No. Does it remove the fun in the game? Not really. Bountyhunters are not hard for the ones who can sail. I can easily take one out solo in 3 or 4 broadsides. It's not avoiding facing hunters. It's mainly to save time on runs, because you don't have to do a lot of running, turning, attacking, running, turning, attacking so on and so forth. Some people don't have the skill to fight Hunters, also. Not many people on this game can sail as well as hunters require. I've been on tons of ships who can't even sink a simple Cutter Shark without losing half their HP. Like I said; it's just as wrong to pretty much say people who do EoW are scared of challenges and hunters as it is to tell someone they're a 'noob' to not do it.
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Indeed it does affect gameplay; it allows for pirates to gather what they need to customize their ships faster than those who do fight against the hunters, and as such they gain an advantage over those pirates in areas like privateering. I assure you the main reason many pirates use this glitch is not because they are inexperienced.

And just because a group of pirates does not have the ability to handle the hunters does not mean they need to resort to exploits to fight them. One of the biggest essentials of this game is too socialize with others to see if they can help you in what your need to get accomplish, and it's a common misconception among pirates that once you are mastered or high-leveled you no longer need to seek help - in fact, this couldn't be farther from the truth. Plenty of times I find myself searching for help from other pirates, whether I know them or not, and there is not shame in admitting that I can't do something by myself. (If it weren't for my guild mates, I'd be sitting in an empty crate in Tortuag somewhere!)

We have forums, guilds, public ship systems, and open forms of communication as simple as in-game chat so we can help one another overcome the obstacles we face. If a pirate can't accomplish something without having to go towards an exploit like this, then they should consider looking for help from other pirates, even if that means searching in places they have never looked in. That's part of the adventure, after all ;)
 
Apparently this is a 'sticky' subject. I don't have a strong enough ship yet to captain myself, since I took a long absence from the game and just recently came back. So far I've been only gunning for my friends who were the Captains, and I have done them either way.

I actually agree that 'anything that is not intended to function on the game' can be considered a glitch. I have been wondering all this time, who actually invented this 'glitch'. But anyway, if I apply my own definition of glitch to any abnormality on the game, then it is true that some glitches are harmful to the game, or to other players, and some others are not, and even helpful for the progression of the players throughout the game. I'm not saying that glitches are wrong or not, but we can pretty much see that whatever that is harmful, is wrong. And whatever that is not harmful, is not always right.

I have a friend who likes to do things in a snap, snap, snap, and he loves sailing so much, it really does not matter there is the End of The World glitch or not. He's such a great Captain with 21 mastered pirates that he can do things the way he likes it, which is facing the challenges head on. So, on my trip with him, when he needed an adrenalin rush, EotW glitch seemed to be too slow for him. Fine with me. But at the end of the trip, he got tired and just wanted to take things slowly, so he did EotW glitch. Fine with me also.

What I am trying to get across here is that, glitch is something that is not supposed to be there. Period. Whether pirates should or should not do the unharmful one, it totally up to individual pirate. I am fine either way, and I don't depend on it. That's the whole point. It's a matter of choice. To help us make the choice, Lord Mouse with his elves could try to eliminate the other choice, so that we only have one choice, which is no glitch. But if it comes down to individual conscience, let it be you yourself, who ask, whether you could live with doing it, or not.

That is also the bottom line of why it is wrong for other players to insult, belittle, or look down on anybody who prefers not to do glitch. That is the real problem here. So to me, it's not so much of whether everybody should be choosing to glitch or not anymore. Maybe we should have an announcement when we invite other pirates to board our ship, that we are not going to do EofW glitch. So let it be known, and anybody who has problem with it, is free to leave. It's the Captain's ship after all, he/she can decide which way he/she wants to go with.

I'm just going to throw this out there: Is there anybody who does not do the "lava glitch" when he/she is leveling up grenades at the Catacombs-Padres? If you think about it, it's similar to the EofW glitch. It is something that is not designed to be there, but it is still there all this time. And it is not harmful to the game or other players, and it is also very helpful for the player's progression on the game. If we discuss the pros and cons about the EofW glitch, should we not touch other 'glitches' as well that are similar in nature? Of course, Ship customization is the trend right now ... so other similar glitches out there that have been there, almost being accepted as if they are parts of the game all this time, are pale in comparison. I'm just saying ... and probably there are other glitches like those that I'm not aware of (potions, for higher level ones, are they still working? Or fast charging broadsides with unsheathed dagger, is it still working? Etc.). Just something to think about.

Lord Mouse and his elves, have a lot of homework ... and we - players - have to make our own calls as well. :)
 
Personally, I choose not to use it. Mostly since I'm a mastered level 50 with a couple of high level ships - gotta love Storm Chaser! :cannon: I can usually gather a crew of high level pirates. I find that going head on in battle is a much faster way of gathering materials, and a whole lot of fun once the warships make it two on one.

Many pirates in the Ocean Warlord guild use the edge tactic, and really I find no fault in it, other than it takes so bloody long!

Either way, I think the biggest problem is when I open to public and I have a couple of noobs screaming "PORT NOW, WE'RE FULL!" the second the hold tops out.
 
I believe that this glitch (and all others) are cheating. However, since Disney won't fix these kinds of glitches or "cheats," then the users can use them all they wish. However, the people you described on your ship who were yelling at your guild should have looked a bit deeper into your guild's code of honor before making complete and utter neanderthals of themselves, yelling at the ship's captain to do this glitch. Usually on ships, I just man the repair spots constantly and only occasionally take the cannon (even when I was unlimited access), but if I were to man a cannon or the wheel, i'd appreciate that there would be a challenge awaiting me in the bounty hunters.
 
Capt. Del,

I hadn't noticed that you mentioned having had opened your ship to public. When my ship is open to public, I fully expect to have at least one or two "bad characters" aboard. I have found that when arguments break out over tactics & cheats, or someone just gets nasty / whines, as they inevitably seem to these days; I encourage my guild-mates & crew to use the ignore button rather than engaging (therefore encouraging) the argument / insults.
I find that once the person realizes that nobody is even listening, they tend to leave pretty quickly.

As for the edge being a cheat - I do think that it is, though not in the same vein as the infuriating SVS invincibility glitch, so I would prefer that Disney target glitches like that first.

I spotted that many people's argument is that the edge allows pirates to gain materials quicker than a straight fight. I completely disagree there - I find that fighting fair vs. hunters & warships requires sailing quite aggressively (especially once the warships arrive) and yields a full hold of materials much faster than the edge. I guess it could be argued that a pirate can acquire rare materials faster, but I don't think so since I can do two or three runs in the time it takes an edge using ship to complete one. Also, I've found that I sail well enough to get one or two warships sunk even while sailing solo - try that on the edge!

I do allow the edge tactic to be used in my guild (both former GMs allowed it, so that's a battle I choose not to fight), but again, I don't use it.
 
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