You meet the nicest people in this game.

[Eric Sailcutter]

Ugh, oh, Misha, I know you asked that your post not be responded to but I just feel I've got to say a couple of things anyway:

1. My comment about moderation mistakes is meant as support for minimal punishment of trolls, a position that TLOPO seems to agree with based on the Moderation Policy revision that you have mentioned. My real suggestion is that a fast response that removes a troll from the situation that they are causing is the key to control, when a troll can not persist they can not be a bother.
2. I'm not really sure exactly how the report button works and what information moderators can find and see when it is used, maybe you could shed some light on that subject? My sense is that the report button is too slow to be effective as a deterrent to trolling and that is why I liked the idea of an active call button. I agree that it could be impractical, so it's just one concept that may not be the best to come out if this thread, and subject to abuse itself so such things would need a lot of thought and testing should they be tried. I hope it is not true that such a system would cause stress on moderators and that the system, if adopted, would be designed to specifically be stress free for the moderator. That is why I suggested that the moderator come and observe without interaction between parties and then just follow the preset rules for intervention. I think it is important that any system be as a matter of fact as possible with minimal subjectivity in decision making.

 

[Shamus The Brute]

Naming and shaming...is a "negative" connotation used for the word accountability. It all comes down to intention and to be clear, this forums has publicly warned people about someone and his actions. I agree with that decision made but especially...because it worked.

Anyway, I hope the issue this OP does address can eventually be resolved. Accountability itself is an important thing simply because it will always be needed.

 

[Blondie357]

One of the reasons I feel so strongly about taking action against the bullies is because awhile back, I witnessed a player on Tortuga with several of their friends role playing disabled people. Autism was even mentioned. Just two nights ago I witnessed yet again these people bickering on Tortuga and making several references to other people being disabled. Yes, I can ignore them. Should I have to? NO. There's ignorant, naive behavior all over sometimes, and then there is just crossing the line. My AUTISTIC son gets on here and plays once in awhile but doesn't really understand some of the mechanics of the game, and there is no earthly excuse he should have to come along and witness those kinds of comments. I do report those kinds of people, but the reporting process could also be more defined (as in what category should be chosen in an instance like that?) Seems like some of the topics you report a person for aren't covered in what you have to choose from. I feel that just because I can ignore them and not see the bull they are spewing, doesn't mean they should get to continue doing it (when its an absolutely despicable behavior such as described above). I agree with the accountability and I know shaming is bullying, but sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire to get them to understand how awful their actions are, IMO.

 

[Crashalot]

I have never encountered anyone who was more than a little annoying in-game.
That being said, if some of the stories posted herein are true, then the mods need to be stepping up, as it sounds terrible.

 

[CycoChelz]

A toxic community is known to be in every online game, doesn't matter if it's free or not, as long as it has a community you will find some pretty toxic situations due to people thinking they can hide behind a keyboard to feel powerful. If you haven't experience this please consider yourself lucky and be thankful. However, For this, I say it's shameful we have this type of issue that several players have to deal with, no matter if you haven't dealt with it before it should be known that this is a major issue that the staff always known about which is why there are several options to remove those types of people if they are causing harm such as harassment or worst. in my own personal experience I've dealt with some pretty bad bullying from players back in POTCO & TLOPO especially . Recently I had dealt with some serious issues due to the harassments ect. I have reported it many times but of course if a person(s) is that shallow to take down others they will do anything to feel "powerful" no matter the risk what may follow.

I find this to be a waste of time on their part, but this doesn't mean to just assume this type of situation doesn't happen. There has been some serious events due to bullying in any games and honestly TLOPO's community isn't any different and there needs to be something serious to be dealt with. No one should ever feel the need to belittle others just for their own entertainment or feel like they have to just to prove something. It is wrong and for those who commits these issues should realise protentional harming others no matter how the matter is done is a extremely serious issue.

This includes Name Calling, making players feel like they are less of a person for whatever reason, any discrimination or just simply setting up rumors, Pretty much Any type of Harassment, and of course cyberstalking which is ALL very serious in game and in real life. For some this could be considered a federal crime depending on how serious the issue is. For those who been committing these situations for others please think about this for a minute and start taking actions to treat people right!
We are suppose to be a "Community" think about the term for a minute. If there is any serious situations going on please report the incident with proof of screenshot and try to advoid those people if best as possible.

 

[Misha]

One of the reasons I feel so strongly about taking action against the bullies is because awhile back, I witnessed a player on Tortuga with several of their friends role playing disabled people. Autism was even mentioned. Just two nights ago I witnessed yet again these people bickering on Tortuga and making several references to other people being disabled. Yes, I can ignore them. Should I have to? NO. There's ignorant, naive behavior all over sometimes, and then there is just crossing the line. My AUTISTIC son gets on here and plays once in awhile but doesn't really understand some of the mechanics of the game, and there is no earthly excuse he should have to come along and witness those kinds of comments. I do report those kinds of people, but the reporting process could also be more defined (as in what category should be chosen in an instance like that?) Seems like some of the topics you report a person for aren't covered in what you have to choose from. I feel that just because I can ignore them and not see the bull they are spewing, doesn't mean they should get to continue doing it (when its an absolutely despicable behavior such as described above). I agree with the accountability and I know shaming is bullying, but sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire to get them to understand how awful their actions are, IMO.

I think you may have misinterpreted @Kate Goldwalker's post, if not completely missed it. If there is an issue with things of those sorts, Report Them. Ignoring is good on a personal level if someone is just personally annoying you, but when it comes to chat violations and the belligerent use of a topic that should not be discussed in an online game, please, report it.

There are so many verbal complaints regarding issues going on via Chat for Moderation to step-by-step moderate. Reporting it gives us much needed information in handling the issue, rather than letting it seethe and grow into something much worse.

 

[squintz]

I love the direction in which this thread is heading regarding security against trolls and mischievous players, however, I do want to point out a couple things from the above few posts (not just the quoted one).

A call-mod button is already in the game, you see. The "Report" feature acts more efficiently in comparison, which is why we often recommend to simply just report the player accordingly. There is no reason for an active call button, and is quite a stress-inducing feature for staff if they must be immediately called to your location. It doesn't make sense.

If you recall back to the recent Moderation Policy revision posted here on the forums on August 25th, It was stated by the crew that as an extension of this change, players will no longer face termination for chat offenses, even if they hit our ten point threshold. This is taking steps away from full on banning players regarding their chat infractions, and to my knowledge this is the only extent of trolling that is readily doable in TLOPO.

On the other hand, things such as abuse of systems regarding in-game mechanics would technically be more in the realm of player griefing. Stealing looting spots, blocking player ships, etc. But if chat violations are still in order, then Report them!

Finally, I wanted to grab this line from your most recent post @Eric Sailcutter:


Yes, mistakes happen, as we are all only human and things do happen. However, I'm not sure what you are suggesting would be an efficient way in dealing with the problem of trolls and mischief.

I DO ask that this post in specific not be responded to, as I have no intention to derail the thread. Keep putting out ideas, we are paying attention and we love to see them.

Misha
Forum Mod"
On the other hand, things such as abuse of systems regarding in-game mechanics would technically be more in the realm of player griefing. Stealing looting spots, blocking player ships, etc.

First, one can not steal what no one owns. As these staff and other moderators have repeated numerous times, there is no such thing as stealing a looting spot no one can own. Period. All moderators and staff should be on the same page about this. There should be no doubt or gray area on this issue.

John Macbatten
TLOPO Staff:
"1. If you believe a player is breaking our Terms of Service, please report them. However, stealing a loot spot isn’t against our rules. We won’t ban players for stealing “your” loot spot. POTCO didn’t ban players for this anyways"

Kate Goldwalker
Fairy Tail Girl
Moderator:
"Turning to what I like to call Hijacking of a loot spot...
This has always been an issue in POTCO and TLOPO, and unfortunately there is one form of this or another in all games and in all platforms. This is the hardest thing for any staff of any game to moderate BECAUSE there is no area in game that can be 'owned' or 'leased' or 'rented' by any one player or group of players. The problem is, I don't see any way that this could be moderated as we all wish it could be."

Second, ship blocking is also not 'griefing', as ship tactics have always included manuvering broadside positions and entrapment. It's all part of sailing attack techniques which are acceptable as well as annoying tactics in pve and svs. While sitting watching svs action, I see this all the time and it's very strategic. Annoying is not griefing.

Third, your post wasn't off topic and as with any other member posting to the forums, I don't believe it's fair and proper to prohibit peoples response to a normal post to the thread. Starting a thread, certainly, responding in the middle of another's thread, not so much.
If one believes a moderators position allows one to shut down responses when ever one feels fit to do so, that may not be the best use of moderation positions.

Fair winds.

 

[squintz]

One of the reasons I feel so strongly about taking action against the bullies is because awhile back, I witnessed a player on Tortuga with several of their friends role playing disabled people. Autism was even mentioned. Just two nights ago I witnessed yet again these people bickering on Tortuga and making several references to other people being disabled. Yes, I can ignore them. Should I have to? NO. There's ignorant, naive behavior all over sometimes, and then there is just crossing the line. My AUTISTIC son gets on here and plays once in awhile but doesn't really understand some of the mechanics of the game, and there is no earthly excuse he should have to come along and witness those kinds of comments. I do report those kinds of people, but the reporting process could also be more defined (as in what category should be chosen in an instance like that?) Seems like some of the topics you report a person for aren't covered in what you have to choose from. I feel that just because I can ignore them and not see the bull they are spewing, doesn't mean they should get to continue doing it (when its an absolutely despicable behavior such as described above). I agree with the accountability and I know shaming is bullying, but sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire to get them to understand how awful their actions are, IMO.

That is extremely despicable. Months ago I was inexplicably harassed where the perpetrator eluded to involvement in children on my part.
This is a very serious threat. Yours is on the same level. In game action is nearly impossible to intercept this kind of behavior.

First, you won't get satisfaction from this forum. It's not the place. True, the word gets out to a limited number of people that read the tlopo forums. but moderators here have no real game authority at all. IN-Game moderators maybe.

Here's how you can do personal reporting to tlopo. Take plenty of screen shots. From different angles and make sure subject is as centered as possible with the chat portion showing. tlopo somehow has made it difficult to get a full chat page showing as it cuts it down to the short page for some reason while trying to do it live. At the same time as close as possible do a in-game report, even with each screenshot.
With the in-game rep, the rep shows the dates, code processes at the time and support would be able to zero in and match your visuals to the loggings. Or should be able to. You would submit your screenshots and detailed description of what is happening to SUPPORT or the highest tlopo staff you can contact. Not forum mods. Never send any information or personal details to tlopo forum mods.

Good luck, protect yourself and your son with screenshots and correspondence to the right higher ups in the organization.

 

[Maus]

There will always be those type of people no matter what, if you run into someone and they’re violating anything on the Terms of Service, it’s best to just report them and press the Ignore button and let the Game Masters take care of it. Take screenshots if you’re able to visually capture the situation

 

[Shamus The Brute]

There will always be those type of people no matter what, if you run into someone and they’re violating anything on the Terms of Service, it’s best to just report them and and press the Ignore button and let the Game Masters take care of it. Take screenshots if you’re able to visually capture the situation

I am a proponent of reporting. Still...it's not enough (with myself 'knowing' the historical issues this particular game has had prior to the remake).

Back to Eric's point for this thread (I was guilty too for failing to remember it): What ways, besides reporting/ignoring, are possible within TLOPO for the average pirate to take to alleviate quickly a situation similar to booting someone off a ship (for acting unruly)?

Like Eric, I feel the capability is there to offer options besides the reporting/ignore buttons and more importantly...such options are needed to give TLOPO a "PROACTIVE" approach towards unruly players as opposed to just reactive (which 'has always' provided/served to provide an unfair advantage to those intentionally and willfully causing trouble).

 

[Baabaa Booey]

One of the reasons I feel so strongly about taking action against the bullies is because awhile back, I witnessed a player on Tortuga with several of their friends role playing disabled people. Autism was even mentioned. Just two nights ago I witnessed yet again these people bickering on Tortuga and making several references to other people being disabled. Yes, I can ignore them. Should I have to? NO. There's ignorant, naive behavior all over sometimes, and then there is just crossing the line. My AUTISTIC son gets on here and plays once in awhile but doesn't really understand some of the mechanics of the game, and there is no earthly excuse he should have to come along and witness those kinds of comments. I do report those kinds of people, but the reporting process could also be more defined (as in what category should be chosen in an instance like that?) Seems like some of the topics you report a person for aren't covered in what you have to choose from. I feel that just because I can ignore them and not see the bull they are spewing, doesn't mean they should get to continue doing it (when its an absolutely despicable behavior such as described above). I agree with the accountability and I know shaming is bullying, but sometimes you gotta fight fire with fire to get them to understand how awful their actions are, IMO.

I happened to be with Blondie on this night it occurred. The person then wanted to voice chat me and i said no i dont do it he then said well then come by my house and we can talk. So i said in chat send me the directions and i book a flight. Now for that little comment i was reported and had a point added to my account for harassment. So i ask what did i say wrong to be hit with a point for harassment on here while these people say whatever they want to say.

 

[Kate Goldwalker]

Let me clarify how the Ignore button works. I think people have been misunderstanding me and thinking I mean you should just ignore it and walk off. That's not exactly what I mean.

Please test this out in game if you want. You can always Unignore someone as well.

Here is how it works:

There is someone in game annoying your or saying things that are offensive in one way or another. Click on their name in the chat box. That will then pull up their player card. On the player card find the button that is the Shield with an ! inside. (see my pic in post above). When you click this button, their chat will not longer be visible to you in game. Anything they say will not show up on the chat box or in a bubble above their head on your screen. So, if they keep saying offensive stuff, you will never know. This is also how the report button works when you report someone. The difference with the report is that there will be a report sent to the moderation with whatever offense they are reported for. There should also be a pink 'IGNORED' visible above their pirate's head of anyone who has either been Ignored or Reported.

You can test this out on a friend in game or some random person but clicking it, watching the chat, and then clicking it again to Unignore.

 

[Shamus The Brute]

I guess the ignore option is not so bad. Only thing is, it only solves things for any "victim." It will never solve nor alleviate nor deter bad behavior.

*I wish there was a way to impact bad behavior in a way to where all these other things implemented weren't necessary.

 

[squintz]

I am a proponent of reporting. Still...it's not enough (with myself 'knowing' the historical issues this particular game has had prior to the remake).

Back to Eric's point for this thread (I was guilty too for failing to remember it): What ways, besides reporting/ignoring, are possible within TLOPO for the average pirate to take to alleviate quickly a situation similar to booting someone off a ship (for acting unruly)?

Like Eric, I feel the capability is there to offer options besides the reporting/ignore buttons and more importantly...such options are needed to give TLOPO a "PROACTIVE" approach towards unruly players as opposed to just reactive (which 'has always' provided/served to provide an unfair advantage to those intentionally and willfully causing trouble).

I meant to ask. With your idea of a beacon of light, would this only be visible to staff and game mods? If so, by highlighting a player yourself, it could be a private matter hopefully responded to by staff. I'm assuming it would be only between you and game mods or whomever is present at the time? As with law enforcement surveillance, you never let the subject know they are reported and being watched, as this knowledge allows them to alter their conduct.

 

[Truecrash]

Ahoy, pirates!

Just to be clear, we will not be implementing a system that allows players to request a moderator on the spot, or that marks a player in any way. These systems would put too much stress on staff, regardless of how they're implemented, and be far too easy to abuse.

Kate and Misha have it completely correct here -- please report players that are breaking the rules in-game. This is, and has always been, the best way to ensure we are able to handle the situation. We are not against hearing potential changes to the rules, but entirely new systems that defeat the purpose of reporting will not be considered.

Here's how you can do personal reporting to tlopo. Take plenty of screen shots. From different angles and make sure subject is as centered as possible with the chat portion showing. tlopo somehow has made it difficult to get a full chat page showing as it cuts it down to the short page for some reason while trying to do it live. At the same time as close as possible do a in-game report, even with each screenshot.
With the in-game rep, the rep shows the dates, code processes at the time and support would be able to zero in and match your visuals to the loggings. Or should be able to. You would submit your screenshots and detailed description of what is happening to SUPPORT or the highest tlopo staff you can contact. Not forum mods. Never send any information or personal details to tlopo forum mods.

Please do not do this. Support is not for reporting players, and they will be unable to help you. The in-game report option should be used for this instead.

 

[squintz]

Ahoy, pirates!

Just to be clear, we will not be implementing a system that allows players to request a moderator on the spot, or that marks a player in any way. These systems would put too much stress on staff, regardless of how they're implemented, and be far too easy to abuse.

Kate and Misha have it completely correct here -- please report players that are breaking the rules in-game. This is, and has always been, the best way to ensure we are able to handle the situation. We are not against hearing potential changes to the rules, but entirely new systems that defeat the purpose of reporting will not be considered.



Please do not do this. Support is not for reporting players, and they will be unable to help you. The in-game report option should be used for this instead.

I disagree. People need to protect themselves and have a record of misconduct by other players. There is nothing wrong with taking screenshots and in-game reports that are already available. I clearly said to go above support to top brass of tlopo if a one on one is needed, support as you said wouldn't be able to help much. What's being discussed is above normal conduct and game support would probably not have enough authorization to make decisions.
Thanks for your input.

 

[Truecrash]

I disagree. People need to protect themselves and have a record of misconduct by other players. There is nothing wrong with taking screenshots and in-game reports that are already available. I clearly said to go above support to top brass of tlopo, support as you said wouldn't be able to help much. What's being discussed is above normal conduct and game support would probably not have enough authorization to make decisions.
Thanks for your input.

It's fine you disagree, but I'm telling you this as a staff member, so please do not just dismiss what I've said so quickly. There's nothing wrong with taking screenshots, but they will not help moderators, and are really only going to be useful for your own purposes.

As for going to 'the top brass of tlopo', that is exactly what you are doing when you report a player in-game, as it is moderators that have the final say with any misconduct. Directly contacting staff over disputes or rule breaking in-game will not have any additional beneficial effects.

 

[squintz]

It's fine you disagree, but I'm telling you this as a staff member, so please do not just dismiss what I've said so quickly. There's nothing wrong with taking screenshots, but they will not help moderators, and are really only going to be useful for your own purposes.

As for going to 'the top brass of tlopo', that is exactly what you are doing when you report a player in-game, as it is moderators that have the final say with any misconduct. Directly contacting staff over disputes or rule breaking in-game will not have any additional beneficial effects.

Okay. Moderators as in forum moderators or in-game moderators? I was of a understanding that forum moderators have nothing to do with real time in-game activities. Is this true?
Are you implying personal threats and potential real world legality in conduct will not be professionally handled by the owners of tlopo?
I understand this is a private enterprise of a public game and forum, but at some point someone at the top would have to take responsibility concerning issues that go beyond game conduct. At least I would like to believe that is true.
It's also a given that the owners and staff of tlopo would have protection as well.
Thanks for the response, truecrash.

 

[Truecrash]

Okay. Moderators as in forum moderators or in-game moderators? I was of a understanding that forum moderators have nothing to do with real time in-game activities. Is this true?

I'm speaking of in-game moderators.

Are you implying personal threats and potential real world legality in conduct will not be professionally handled by the owners of tlopo?

No? What?? I'm saying that the response will be to report the player in-game so that moderators can handle it appropriately. Where did you get this from my post??

I understand this is a private enterprise of a public game and forum, but at some point someone at the top would have to take responsibility concerning issues that go beyond game conduct. At least I would like to believe that is true.
It's also a given that the owners and staff of tlopo would have protection as well.
Thanks for the response, truecrash.

Just so we're clear, TLOPO doesn't own these forums, it sounds like you may think we do. They're kind enough to let us have a place here, but they are their own entity.

People 'at the top' already take responsibility for these things. It's why we have moderators, who work diligently to protect the players of the game. Messaging staff directly will NOT help you, you need to use the tools we've given you to resolve the situation. If the player is indeed breaking the Terms of Service, the moderators have all the tools necessary to figure this out once the player is reported, and to resolve the situation appropriately.

Believe me when I say, we have given mods every tool we can to ensure players are protected in this fine Caribbean. Heck, I even built a few myself! However, the point I'm trying to make is that it all starts with a report. It's really just that simple.

 

[squintz]

I'm speaking of in-game moderators.



No? What?? I'm saying that the response will be to report the player in-game so that moderators can handle it appropriately. Where did you get this from my post??



Just so we're clear, TLOPO doesn't own these forums, it sounds like you may think we do. They're kind enough to let us have a place here, but they are their own entity.

People 'at the top' already take responsibility for these things. It's why we have moderators, who work diligently to protect the players of the game. Messaging staff directly will NOT help you, you need to use the tools we've given you to resolve the situation. If the player is indeed breaking the Terms of Service, the moderators have all the tools necessary to figure this out once the player is reported, and to resolve the situation appropriately.

Believe me when I say, we have given mods every tool we can to ensure players are protected in this fine Caribbean. Heck, I even built a few myself! However, the point I'm trying to make is that it all starts with a report. It's really just that simple.

Thank you. I knew the forums were not owned by tlopo owners and staff. I do appreciate the venue of the forums however. And I have confidence that the tlopo staff are diligent in regulating problems.